C****n
发帖数: 2324 | 1 I love Romney, in my eyes, he is a perfect man.
Sharp, Smart, have a successful career, and a happy family. He has
everything I am working for. I envy him.
So I support him, I want him to be our president, so I can be like him some
day.
But why so many people do not like him? or hates him?
I have a bold guess, "For the same reason I love him". He is too elite, too
far away from normal folks.
When we see something good, we have different reactions. There's still this
famous story:
A Japanese is touring Manhattan with his friends. When he saw all the rich
houses, mansion, luxury condos, cars, he said: "Man, I got to work hard, and
I swear I will live such a luxury life too some day! That's my goal of my
life".
A Chinese from "Beijing" visiting Manhattan too, and saw the same thing. He
said: "这么好的房子， 他奶奶的， 迟早我要宰了这帮孙子。“
True or false, different mentality. |
d**0
发帖数: 984 | 2 我不喜欢罗姆尼的地方，是觉得他有点像传教士或者销售经理，说话绕来绕去不亮底牌。
some
too
this
【在 C****n 的大作中提到】
: I love Romney, in my eyes, he is a perfect man.
: Sharp, Smart, have a successful career, and a happy family. He has
: everything I am working for. I envy him.
: So I support him, I want him to be our president, so I can be like him some
: day.
: But why so many people do not like him? or hates him?
: I have a bold guess, "For the same reason I love him". He is too elite, too
: far away from normal folks.
: When we see something good, we have different reactions. There's still this
: famous story:
|
e*******e
发帖数: 9616 | 3 他一亮底牌就出事，里外得罪人，干脆不说真话算了。哈哈
牌。
【在 d**0 的大作中提到】
: 我不喜欢罗姆尼的地方，是觉得他有点像传教士或者销售经理，说话绕来绕去不亮底牌。
:
: some
: too
: this
|
r*****t
发帖数: 7278 | |
s********t
发帖数: 4150 | 5 I agree.
some
too
this
【在 C****n 的大作中提到】
: I love Romney, in my eyes, he is a perfect man.
: Sharp, Smart, have a successful career, and a happy family. He has
: everything I am working for. I envy him.
: So I support him, I want him to be our president, so I can be like him some
: day.
: But why so many people do not like him? or hates him?
: I have a bold guess, "For the same reason I love him". He is too elite, too
: far away from normal folks.
: When we see something good, we have different reactions. There's still this
: famous story:
|
z******o
发帖数: 3073 | 6 奥巴马演技太强大了，你知道美国选民至少40％都是白痴，就看谁会忽悠阿。 |
C****n
发帖数: 2324 | 7 Right.
Like his budget plan, i know he can and he will get it done! Or to say, I
believe he will get it done.
But he can't tell his plan now, because most people will get hurt by his
plan, including me.
But I still support him, because it's a moral thing to do. Leave the debt to
my kids is simply not moral. I don't want my kids living in a world with 90
% income tax (I am not joking, it happened in history before in US.)
The budget needs to be balanced, and we need a tough guy to do this. Just
like Ronald Reagan and Margaret Thatcher.
We don't elect Romney this time, we will need a tougher guy later, it will
be even less pleasant. Let's see.
【在 e*******e 的大作中提到】
: 他一亮底牌就出事，里外得罪人，干脆不说真话算了。哈哈
:
: 牌。
|
Y***a
发帖数: 193 | 8 南方的红搏子大部分都是白痴, 半斤八两.
【在 z******o 的大作中提到】
: 奥巴马演技太强大了，你知道美国选民至少40％都是白痴，就看谁会忽悠阿。
|
b****y
发帖数: 1010 | 9 楼主太幼稚了。
romney是个官二代。他的成功与此有很大关系。
你要崇拜就崇拜老布什，里根。 |
C****n
发帖数: 2324 | 10 When I heard the winter olympic story, I know this is the guy I want in
whitehouse.
Of course he has a lot advantages over normal folks like us. But his Olympic
story, that skillset and determination and courage, is exactly what we need
today in US.
【在 b****y 的大作中提到】
: 楼主太幼稚了。
: romney是个官二代。他的成功与此有很大关系。
: 你要崇拜就崇拜老布什，里根。
|
|
|
d*********2
发帖数: 48111 | 11 其实working class老中从盐湖奥运的事情上看mitten大多都是正面的。
确实， it上台大多数人都要suffer, 就像bloomberg一样， it刚上台我也反感it.
但是这么多年下来， 再跟其他liberat states/cities比较一下， 没有bloomberg，
nyc恐怕早就深陷危机了。
Olympic
need
【在 C****n 的大作中提到】
: When I heard the winter olympic story, I know this is the guy I want in
: whitehouse.
: Of course he has a lot advantages over normal folks like us. But his Olympic
: story, that skillset and determination and courage, is exactly what we need
: today in US.
|
b****y
发帖数: 1010 | 12 你就这么容易被人洗脑？
还什么“determination and courage”？ 看看47%的问题， 几个月前说的话， 几个
月后就承认是“totally wrong”。整个就是一个flip-flop 变色龙。
他要是坚持47%， 我真没准去投他的票。
Olympic
need
【在 C****n 的大作中提到】
: When I heard the winter olympic story, I know this is the guy I want in
: whitehouse.
: Of course he has a lot advantages over normal folks like us. But his Olympic
: story, that skillset and determination and courage, is exactly what we need
: today in US.
|
d*********2
发帖数: 48111 | 13 做实事的人确实经常说漏嘴。
不干事的人往往嘴皮子油， 没那张嘴他靠什么吃饭。
【在 b****y 的大作中提到】
: 你就这么容易被人洗脑？
: 还什么“determination and courage”？ 看看47%的问题， 几个月前说的话， 几个
: 月后就承认是“totally wrong”。整个就是一个flip-flop 变色龙。
: 他要是坚持47%， 我真没准去投他的票。
:
: Olympic
: need
|
C****n
发帖数: 2324 | 14 He has to! In order to get elected.
You can say it's wrong strategy, but he needs to do anything he can to get
elected.
Or else, nothing matters.
【在 b****y 的大作中提到】
: 你就这么容易被人洗脑？
: 还什么“determination and courage”？ 看看47%的问题， 几个月前说的话， 几个
: 月后就承认是“totally wrong”。整个就是一个flip-flop 变色龙。
: 他要是坚持47%， 我真没准去投他的票。
:
: Olympic
: need
|
b****y
发帖数: 1010 | 15 这么说你认为47%是他的心里话？
【在 d*********2 的大作中提到】
: 做实事的人确实经常说漏嘴。
: 不干事的人往往嘴皮子油， 没那张嘴他靠什么吃饭。
|
C****n
发帖数: 2324 | 16 Of course!
也是我的心里话。
【在 b****y 的大作中提到】
: 这么说你认为47%是他的心里话？
|
e*******e
发帖数: 9616 | 17 I think he mean it when he say so.
【在 b****y 的大作中提到】
: 这么说你认为47%是他的心里话？
|
g***y
发帖数: 1268 | 18 Romney的最大问题是businessman。格局太小
在每个问题上都太精打细算。没有principle和courage. 没法有信赖感。 |
b********e
发帖数: 162 | 19 Romney's real problem is HE IS A MORMON. He failed to fire up the
evangelical base. It is stupidity of evangelicals.
The other reasons are convenient but not true.
some
too
this
【在 C****n 的大作中提到】
: I love Romney, in my eyes, he is a perfect man.
: Sharp, Smart, have a successful career, and a happy family. He has
: everything I am working for. I envy him.
: So I support him, I want him to be our president, so I can be like him some
: day.
: But why so many people do not like him? or hates him?
: I have a bold guess, "For the same reason I love him". He is too elite, too
: far away from normal folks.
: When we see something good, we have different reactions. There's still this
: famous story:
|
b****y
发帖数: 1010 | 20 我靠，
我了选票就可以这么没有原则性？
这种鸟人哪能当总统？
我觉得你是romney 黑。
【在 C****n 的大作中提到】
: He has to! In order to get elected.
: You can say it's wrong strategy, but he needs to do anything he can to get
: elected.
: Or else, nothing matters.
|
|
|
d*****y
发帖数: 1365 | 21 我真没看出romney有什么能力,jon huntsman比他强太多了
some
too
this
【在 C****n 的大作中提到】
: I love Romney, in my eyes, he is a perfect man.
: Sharp, Smart, have a successful career, and a happy family. He has
: everything I am working for. I envy him.
: So I support him, I want him to be our president, so I can be like him some
: day.
: But why so many people do not like him? or hates him?
: I have a bold guess, "For the same reason I love him". He is too elite, too
: far away from normal folks.
: When we see something good, we have different reactions. There's still this
: famous story:
|
C****n
发帖数: 2324 | 22 呵呵， I think you are too young! No offense though.
讲原则的人一般活不长。
【在 b****y 的大作中提到】
: 我靠，
: 我了选票就可以这么没有原则性？
: 这种鸟人哪能当总统？
: 我觉得你是romney 黑。
|
C****n
发帖数: 2324 | 23 这个比较没有意义。
只能比较OBAMA and Romney
【在 d*****y 的大作中提到】
: 我真没看出romney有什么能力,jon huntsman比他强太多了
:
: some
: too
: this
|
d*********2
发帖数: 48111 | 24 it严格意义上不算个政客， 稍微一个训练有素的政客就不会犯47%的错。
他还以为再开股东电话会呢。
所以美国的这个政治体系下， 选出个能干的总统确实是巧合， 历史上也是无能的总
统居多。 gw bush和08ma是最好的诠释， 秒杀一切能力比他们强的candidates
【在 g***y 的大作中提到】
: Romney的最大问题是businessman。格局太小
: 在每个问题上都太精打细算。没有principle和courage. 没法有信赖感。
|
w********e
发帖数: 4186 | 25 确实是的，曾经有文章说，罗姆尼宣称自己没继承父亲的任何东西，人家列举一推好处
，比如说，他去纽约面试工作，人大老板是他爹的朋友。
【在 b****y 的大作中提到】
: 楼主太幼稚了。
: romney是个官二代。他的成功与此有很大关系。
: 你要崇拜就崇拜老布什，里根。
|
Y***a
发帖数: 193 | 26 totally right.
【在 g***y 的大作中提到】
: Romney的最大问题是businessman。格局太小
: 在每个问题上都太精打细算。没有principle和courage. 没法有信赖感。
|
b****y
发帖数: 1010 | 27 那么他就要坚持自己的原则， 不能为了迎合部分选民就更改自己的原则。
【在 C****n 的大作中提到】
: Of course!
: 也是我的心里话。
|
b****y
发帖数: 1010 | 28 同意。
【在 g***y 的大作中提到】
: Romney的最大问题是businessman。格局太小
: 在每个问题上都太精打细算。没有principle和courage. 没法有信赖感。
|
b****y
发帖数: 1010 | 29 没这么回事，
版上的GOP都说了， 3000万evangelical在教主的号召下出来投票了。
【在 b********e 的大作中提到】
: Romney's real problem is HE IS A MORMON. He failed to fire up the
: evangelical base. It is stupidity of evangelicals.
: The other reasons are convenient but not true.
:
: some
: too
: this
|
Y***a
发帖数: 193 | 30 我见过jon huntsman,握过手, 还跟我说中文, 此人比ROMNEY 更强更有原则.
【在 d*****y 的大作中提到】
: 我真没看出romney有什么能力,jon huntsman比他强太多了
:
: some
: too
: this
|
|
|
g***y
发帖数: 1268 | 31 jon huntsman也没戏。Utah州长，驻中国大使，都是minus。
【在 d*****y 的大作中提到】
: 我真没看出romney有什么能力,jon huntsman比他强太多了
:
: some
: too
: this
|
w********e
发帖数: 4186 | 32 当然是他的心里话啊。
他对女性的歧视连辩论时也不掩饰一下，回答一个母亲关于找工作时，说，他能让经济
好起来，好得老板到处找人，这时你需要的“迟到早退”的上班时间老板也不介意了。
明摆着你这样的员工不好啊。
【在 b****y 的大作中提到】
: 这么说你认为47%是他的心里话？
|
w********e
发帖数: 4186 | 33 当然是他的心里话啊。
他对女性的歧视连辩论时也不掩饰一下，回答一个母亲关于找工作时，说，他能让经济
好起来，好得老板到处找人，这时你需要的“迟到早退”的上班时间老板也不介意了。
明摆着你这样的员工不好啊。
【在 b****y 的大作中提到】
: 这么说你认为47%是他的心里话？
|
d*********2
发帖数: 48111 | 34 他永远不可能通过任何一个党的初选
美国的这个选举实际上选的是一个idol, 而不是一个executive.
正常年代这个体系很不错， 保持平稳， 确定立场。
但是面对危机的时候就很trouble. 美国帝国荣耀里， 关键时刻都是靠了lincoln,
franklin , reagan这样能力出众做出超出正常总统的贡献才得以延续。
所以美国人强调leadership.
【在 Y***a 的大作中提到】
: 我见过jon huntsman,握过手, 还跟我说中文, 此人比ROMNEY 更强更有原则.
|
d*********2
发帖数: 48111 | 35 现在美国政坛说大实话的人不好混， 太多的政治正确了。
【在 w********e 的大作中提到】
: 当然是他的心里话啊。
: 他对女性的歧视连辩论时也不掩饰一下，回答一个母亲关于找工作时，说，他能让经济
: 好起来，好得老板到处找人，这时你需要的“迟到早退”的上班时间老板也不介意了。
: 明摆着你这样的员工不好啊。
|
b****y
发帖数: 1010 | 36 你当商人可以唯利是图。
但这种人能当总统？
对比一下小布什， 小布什赞同移民改革， 和党内的反移民大佬们发生冲突。在和CO的
某众议院在白宫大吵一架，这位众议员最后以选票相威胁。 小布什让助手告诉他：以
后不要再来玷污白宫门口的地毯。
这，就是有principle的表现。小布什在这一点上甩romney几条街。
【在 C****n 的大作中提到】
: 呵呵， I think you are too young! No offense though.
: 讲原则的人一般活不长。
|
d*****y
发帖数: 1365 | 37 What I see is that, you have so much time during working hours to water in
this board, it is really hard to imagine that you can have a successful
business.
Should Romney spend so much time arguing irrelevant things with other people
during his working hour like you do, he would not have been so successful
as a businessman as he is right now.
some
too
this
【在 C****n 的大作中提到】
: I love Romney, in my eyes, he is a perfect man.
: Sharp, Smart, have a successful career, and a happy family. He has
: everything I am working for. I envy him.
: So I support him, I want him to be our president, so I can be like him some
: day.
: But why so many people do not like him? or hates him?
: I have a bold guess, "For the same reason I love him". He is too elite, too
: far away from normal folks.
: When we see something good, we have different reactions. There's still this
: famous story:
|
b********e
发帖数: 162 | 38 The data suggested otherwise. The GOP establishment made a huge mistake by
either choosing Romney or not helping him firing up the evangelical base
since May.
【在 b****y 的大作中提到】
: 没这么回事，
: 版上的GOP都说了， 3000万evangelical在教主的号召下出来投票了。
|
d*********2
发帖数: 48111 | 39 所以说， 极左和极右的差别只在于屁股。 互相欣赏共同点也很正常
【在 b****y 的大作中提到】
: 你当商人可以唯利是图。
: 但这种人能当总统？
: 对比一下小布什， 小布什赞同移民改革， 和党内的反移民大佬们发生冲突。在和CO的
: 某众议院在白宫大吵一架，这位众议员最后以选票相威胁。 小布什让助手告诉他：以
: 后不要再来玷污白宫门口的地毯。
: 这，就是有principle的表现。小布什在这一点上甩romney几条街。
|
Y***a
发帖数: 193 | 40 的确美国选举很多问题. 系统选不出有能力+懂得民众疾苦的.
这回O8懂得民众疾苦的但能力不强, ROMNEY有能力但不会关心一般人的问题. 哎. |
|
|
b****y
发帖数: 1010 | 41 你觉得romney是个好leader吗？
开公司可能行， 当总统差远了。
【在 d*********2 的大作中提到】
: 他永远不可能通过任何一个党的初选
: 美国的这个选举实际上选的是一个idol, 而不是一个executive.
: 正常年代这个体系很不错， 保持平稳， 确定立场。
: 但是面对危机的时候就很trouble. 美国帝国荣耀里， 关键时刻都是靠了lincoln,
: franklin , reagan这样能力出众做出超出正常总统的贡献才得以延续。
: 所以美国人强调leadership.
|
d*********2
发帖数: 48111 | 42 08ma这个人并不笨， 譬如他早就提出美国的问题在于人才竞争力下降， 应该提高教
育水准。
他这个人问题是太软弱，太容易妥协， 太没有管理经验， 不会做任何细节工作。
提高教育水准只是靠给teachers' union更多钱吗？
共产党还高薪养廉呢
【在 Y***a 的大作中提到】
: 的确美国选举很多问题. 系统选不出有能力+懂得民众疾苦的.
: 这回O8懂得民众疾苦的但能力不强, ROMNEY有能力但不会关心一般人的问题. 哎.
|
S******4
发帖数: 2865 | 43 Romney is a great manager, he will not be a great leader.
And please.... managing a small-scale Winter Olympics in the middle of
nowhere, or manaing a private equity firm are not the same as managing the
world's most powerful country. |
b****y
发帖数: 1010 | 44 romney 关键就是口里不一。让人摸不透。
【在 Y***a 的大作中提到】
: 的确美国选举很多问题. 系统选不出有能力+懂得民众疾苦的.
: 这回O8懂得民众疾苦的但能力不强, ROMNEY有能力但不会关心一般人的问题. 哎.
|
Y***a
发帖数: 193 | 45 同意.
极右分子又硬又臭, 害了共和党, 最后害了美国. 美国未来的钥匙是在中间温和派那
里.
【在 b****y 的大作中提到】
: 你当商人可以唯利是图。
: 但这种人能当总统？
: 对比一下小布什， 小布什赞同移民改革， 和党内的反移民大佬们发生冲突。在和CO的
: 某众议院在白宫大吵一架，这位众议员最后以选票相威胁。 小布什让助手告诉他：以
: 后不要再来玷污白宫门口的地毯。
: 这，就是有principle的表现。小布什在这一点上甩romney几条街。
|
d*********2
发帖数: 48111 | 46 那么连一个社区， 一个公司， 一个奥运会都没有管理好／管理过的， 过去４年国
家的管理也一塌糊涂的可取之处在哪里呢？
【在 S******4 的大作中提到】
: Romney is a great manager, he will not be a great leader.
: And please.... managing a small-scale Winter Olympics in the middle of
: nowhere, or manaing a private equity firm are not the same as managing the
: world's most powerful country.
|
S******4
发帖数: 2865 | 47 Agreed.
And most moderates don't trust Romney to reign the GOP extreme wing.
Romney is one without moral principle and political conviction. Even George
Bush is much better than him in this area.
He appeases to everyone he wants to appease (aka the 47% comment), and he
will bow to GOP maniacs.
【在 Y***a 的大作中提到】
: 同意.
: 极右分子又硬又臭, 害了共和党, 最后害了美国. 美国未来的钥匙是在中间温和派那
: 里.
|
S******4
发帖数: 2865 | 48 Contrary to your twisted logic, experience in private industry and some
pathetically small Winter Olympics in the middle of nowhere has nothing to
do with being a great president.
Did Franklin Delano Roosevelt work in private industry
Did Abraham Lincoln?
You with your limited knowledge in US history bought into the Romney sales
pitch that a great CEO == a great President, which can't be further from
truth.
【在 d*********2 的大作中提到】
: 那么连一个社区， 一个公司， 一个奥运会都没有管理好／管理过的， 过去４年国
: 家的管理也一塌糊涂的可取之处在哪里呢？
|
g***y
发帖数: 1268 | 49 每个人都在说提高教育。Bush还说 no child left behind。
Public school 就是doom了。谁当总统也没用。通常是越有抱负，越想搞好，反而搞的
越糟。
【在 d*********2 的大作中提到】
: 08ma这个人并不笨， 譬如他早就提出美国的问题在于人才竞争力下降， 应该提高教
: 育水准。
: 他这个人问题是太软弱，太容易妥协， 太没有管理经验， 不会做任何细节工作。
: 提高教育水准只是靠给teachers' union更多钱吗？
: 共产党还高薪养廉呢
|
B******e
发帖数: 16928 | 50 The best thing for the government to do is doing nothing and let the market
do their job. Good schools will appear if there is a demand for it.
【在 d*********2 的大作中提到】
: 08ma这个人并不笨， 譬如他早就提出美国的问题在于人才竞争力下降， 应该提高教
: 育水准。
: 他这个人问题是太软弱，太容易妥协， 太没有管理经验， 不会做任何细节工作。
: 提高教育水准只是靠给teachers' union更多钱吗？
: 共产党还高薪养廉呢
|
|
|
b********e
发帖数: 162 | 51 I agree with you completely on this. But the vast majority of the population
think otherwise. More than often, so called "common sense" is wrong.
market
【在 B******e 的大作中提到】
: The best thing for the government to do is doing nothing and let the market
: do their job. Good schools will appear if there is a demand for it.
|
d*********2
发帖数: 48111 | 52 完全取消教育的税务和管理， 完全纯私立。 普通的中产应该不会付出更多。
简单的举例说， 重视教育的华人社区， 请来的老师的cost， 老师的工作时间都会
更令人满意。 送过的学校， 只有华裔有licence的老师肯早来， 愿意在
aftershool prog兼职， 愿意work on weekend.
market
【在 B******e 的大作中提到】
: The best thing for the government to do is doing nothing and let the market
: do their job. Good schools will appear if there is a demand for it.
|
d*********2
发帖数: 48111 | 53 很多理工科wsn的特征， 就是注重细节， 注重解决问题的手段。没有本事， 空想
无用。
缺乏社会经验的， 以为有一个idea就万事大吉了。
【在 g***y 的大作中提到】
: 每个人都在说提高教育。Bush还说 no child left behind。
: Public school 就是doom了。谁当总统也没用。通常是越有抱负，越想搞好，反而搞的
: 越糟。
|
b********e
发帖数: 162 | 54 There would be a shortage of teachers since many teachers will be fired due
to incompetence.
【在 d*********2 的大作中提到】
: 完全取消教育的税务和管理， 完全纯私立。 普通的中产应该不会付出更多。
: 简单的举例说， 重视教育的华人社区， 请来的老师的cost， 老师的工作时间都会
: 更令人满意。 送过的学校， 只有华裔有licence的老师肯早来， 愿意在
: aftershool prog兼职， 愿意work on weekend.
:
: market
|
h********0
发帖数: 12056 | 55 you bash everyone as idiots if they do not agree with your silly
comments. The following is the stupidest one I have seen
on education. You are really so naive! Even communists
know that education is a long term work.
market
【在 B******e 的大作中提到】
: The best thing for the government to do is doing nothing and let the market
: do their job. Good schools will appear if there is a demand for it.
|
S******4
发帖数: 2865 | 56 Good, let's have a mature argument.
Firstly, you misunderstand the role of Presidency.
President is not a manager, he is a leader. He needs to have vision and sets
agenda and gets his agenda through Congress.
That's what I mean that Romney should not be President, his skills qualify
him to be a cabinet member, an executor, a manager, an implementor of policy.
Obama will not have time for 细节工作, that's not his job.
What Obama should do for second term is:
Get off his high horse, play golf, have dinners and work with GOP House. I
like John Boehner, he is a reasonable guy, and Tea Pary is on the wane. The
next month is critical, it sets tone for the next 4 years.
【在 d*********2 的大作中提到】
: 08ma这个人并不笨， 譬如他早就提出美国的问题在于人才竞争力下降， 应该提高教
: 育水准。
: 他这个人问题是太软弱，太容易妥协， 太没有管理经验， 不会做任何细节工作。
: 提高教育水准只是靠给teachers' union更多钱吗？
: 共产党还高薪养廉呢
|
B******e
发帖数: 16928 | 57 The fact is that charter schools do better than public schools. You cannot
beat the market. Whoever does not understand this is an idiot. Period.
Communist? Yes they managed their economy very good.
【在 h********0 的大作中提到】
: you bash everyone as idiots if they do not agree with your silly
: comments. The following is the stupidest one I have seen
: on education. You are really so naive! Even communists
: know that education is a long term work.
:
: market
|
d*********2
发帖数: 48111 | 58 好的老师还是很多的， 本来美国这个教师行业就没有什么技术含量。
很多华人更nice, 更有耐心， 但是不知道为什么就是没有licence, 只能在学校或者
补习学校打杂。
其实勤奋点的老师收入也是会很高的， 我送娃去的补习班， 那个老师才４０多，
已经在大脖小脖南staten好几栋房子了。 人正常的上班时间挺短的， 组织了一票勤
奋的华裔老师开了个GT补习班， 呵呵， 她说她去拉老美的老师， 没有一个愿意
work on weekend的。
在美国， 计划去读teaching school的就已经是后天的懒人category了。
due
【在 b********e 的大作中提到】
: There would be a shortage of teachers since many teachers will be fired due
: to incompetence.
|
B******e
发帖数: 16928 | 59 So you mean a governor of Massachusetts do not need to be a leader? For CEO,
the most important quality is leadership.
sets
policy.
The
【在 S******4 的大作中提到】
: Good, let's have a mature argument.
: Firstly, you misunderstand the role of Presidency.
: President is not a manager, he is a leader. He needs to have vision and sets
: agenda and gets his agenda through Congress.
: That's what I mean that Romney should not be President, his skills qualify
: him to be a cabinet member, an executor, a manager, an implementor of policy.
: Obama will not have time for 细节工作, that's not his job.
: What Obama should do for second term is:
: Get off his high horse, play golf, have dinners and work with GOP House. I
: like John Boehner, he is a reasonable guy, and Tea Pary is on the wane. The
|
d*********2
发帖数: 48111 | 60 真的懒的再和你们这些小白废话了。
clinton所以被称为美国近年来最成功的总统， 就在于它强大的协调国会， 达成自
己目的的能力。
真以为做总统就是动动嘴皮子， vision? 难怪你们会fan一个yes we can
sets
policy.
The
【在 S******4 的大作中提到】
: Good, let's have a mature argument.
: Firstly, you misunderstand the role of Presidency.
: President is not a manager, he is a leader. He needs to have vision and sets
: agenda and gets his agenda through Congress.
: That's what I mean that Romney should not be President, his skills qualify
: him to be a cabinet member, an executor, a manager, an implementor of policy.
: Obama will not have time for 细节工作, that's not his job.
: What Obama should do for second term is:
: Get off his high horse, play golf, have dinners and work with GOP House. I
: like John Boehner, he is a reasonable guy, and Tea Pary is on the wane. The
|
|
|
S******4
发帖数: 2865 | 61 That's completely, absolutely, horrendously, 100% BULLSHIT.
By your disgusting and stupid logic, demand for good schools will only
appear in rich districts. Good teachers should only teach the young Romneys,
but
not the young Obamas.
This is why we have public education in every country in the world, US,
China, Europe and even North Korea...
Government should provide basic education to everyone regardless of race,
income and gender.
If what you said becomes true (believe it won't), then it would really be
the end of America and modern civilization as we know it.
market
【在 B******e 的大作中提到】
: The best thing for the government to do is doing nothing and let the market
: do their job. Good schools will appear if there is a demand for it.
|
B******e
发帖数: 16928 | 62 If Obama is smart enough, then good schools will want to recruit him and
provide him financial aid, because the school knows that Obama will shine in
the future and will boost the school's reputation and attract more smart
students to come, which further boosts the school's reputation. Market force
always works. If you are smart or you are rich, you will be good. Those who
are stupid and lazy but still want a good education, I am sorry, you do not
deserve it.
【在 S******4 的大作中提到】
: That's completely, absolutely, horrendously, 100% BULLSHIT.
: By your disgusting and stupid logic, demand for good schools will only
: appear in rich districts. Good teachers should only teach the young Romneys,
: but
: not the young Obamas.
: This is why we have public education in every country in the world, US,
: China, Europe and even North Korea...
: Government should provide basic education to everyone regardless of race,
: income and gender.
: If what you said becomes true (believe it won't), then it would really be
|
S******4
发帖数: 2865 | 63 There is no financial aid for primary, middle and high school you IDIOT.
If you live in a poor district, should your child have access to quality
primary, middle and high school? How does the market guarantee that?
in
force
who
not
【在 B******e 的大作中提到】
: If Obama is smart enough, then good schools will want to recruit him and
: provide him financial aid, because the school knows that Obama will shine in
: the future and will boost the school's reputation and attract more smart
: students to come, which further boosts the school's reputation. Market force
: always works. If you are smart or you are rich, you will be good. Those who
: are stupid and lazy but still want a good education, I am sorry, you do not
: deserve it.
|
b********e
发帖数: 162 | 64 The question is what the defination of "good education" is.
My defination is "to give the student the ability to survive and prosper in
a complex society".
You probably have a different defination.
Romneys,
【在 S******4 的大作中提到】
: That's completely, absolutely, horrendously, 100% BULLSHIT.
: By your disgusting and stupid logic, demand for good schools will only
: appear in rich districts. Good teachers should only teach the young Romneys,
: but
: not the young Obamas.
: This is why we have public education in every country in the world, US,
: China, Europe and even North Korea...
: Government should provide basic education to everyone regardless of race,
: income and gender.
: If what you said becomes true (believe it won't), then it would really be
|
B******e
发帖数: 16928 | 65 If you leave the solution to the market, good schools who have cash will
offer this solution. The best thing to let the market work out the solution
is that you do not need to worry about anything and market will take care of
everything.
【在 S******4 的大作中提到】
: There is no financial aid for primary, middle and high school you IDIOT.
: If you live in a poor district, should your child have access to quality
: primary, middle and high school? How does the market guarantee that?
:
: in
: force
: who
: not
|
B******e
发帖数: 16928 | 66 If you live in a poor district but you emphasize a lot on your kid's
education and your kid shows the potential of becoming a future star, under
a market solution your kids will get offers from good schools. But for those
black culture which disdains education, of course you do not deserve it.
Let you have the opportunity is taking away an opportunity for a better fit
kid.
【在 S******4 的大作中提到】
: There is no financial aid for primary, middle and high school you IDIOT.
: If you live in a poor district, should your child have access to quality
: primary, middle and high school? How does the market guarantee that?
:
: in
: force
: who
: not
|
j*********d
发帖数: 1137 | 67 Romney就是个成功的商人。论政治，就是个loser。比他成功的商人多了去了，我看
Elon Musk都比他牛逼。
some
too
this
【在 C****n 的大作中提到】
: I love Romney, in my eyes, he is a perfect man.
: Sharp, Smart, have a successful career, and a happy family. He has
: everything I am working for. I envy him.
: So I support him, I want him to be our president, so I can be like him some
: day.
: But why so many people do not like him? or hates him?
: I have a bold guess, "For the same reason I love him". He is too elite, too
: far away from normal folks.
: When we see something good, we have different reactions. There's still this
: famous story:
|
d*********2
发帖数: 48111 | 68 最简单的solution就是loan.
under
those
fit
【在 B******e 的大作中提到】
: If you live in a poor district but you emphasize a lot on your kid's
: education and your kid shows the potential of becoming a future star, under
: a market solution your kids will get offers from good schools. But for those
: black culture which disdains education, of course you do not deserve it.
: Let you have the opportunity is taking away an opportunity for a better fit
: kid.
|
S******4
发帖数: 2865 | 69 Let's be real, you are the President of a good school.
Do you
(1) Accept rich kids, charge them a lot, build a strong alumni with their
rich parents. With all the money, you can hire great teachers and make your
schools better.
(2) Accept poor kids and pay them. Hope their own academic merits will make
your school better, even if you might not have money to hire good teachers
and build good schools.
For now, (1) has been happening throughout this country, and throughout the
whole human history.
Your theory is... a wrong theory at best.
You are like those Romney supporters who says "cutting tax for the rich will
create jobs" even though there was ZERO evidence of that in the whole
history of modern economics.
See ya, I don't wanna lower myself in talking to you anymore.
under
those
fit
【在 B******e 的大作中提到】
: If you live in a poor district but you emphasize a lot on your kid's
: education and your kid shows the potential of becoming a future star, under
: a market solution your kids will get offers from good schools. But for those
: black culture which disdains education, of course you do not deserve it.
: Let you have the opportunity is taking away an opportunity for a better fit
: kid.
|
B******e
发帖数: 16928 | 70 Why does Harvard accept poor kids?
your
make
the
【在 S******4 的大作中提到】
: Let's be real, you are the President of a good school.
: Do you
: (1) Accept rich kids, charge them a lot, build a strong alumni with their
: rich parents. With all the money, you can hire great teachers and make your
: schools better.
: (2) Accept poor kids and pay them. Hope their own academic merits will make
: your school better, even if you might not have money to hire good teachers
: and build good schools.
: For now, (1) has been happening throughout this country, and throughout the
: whole human history.
|
|
|
h********0
发帖数: 12056 | 71 Don't pretend you are from an elite family, you are a world apart
from it. Charter schools do better than public, and harvard and MIT
do better than state universities, do you suggest we should not
invest in state universities? common, don't behave like a child. Small
government is good, but it does not mean public education is
not important.
【在 B******e 的大作中提到】
: The fact is that charter schools do better than public schools. You cannot
: beat the market. Whoever does not understand this is an idiot. Period.
: Communist? Yes they managed their economy very good.
|
m******O
发帖数: 596 | 72 "some pathetically small Winter Olympics in the middle of nowhere"
你在另一个帖子里说你要“严肃的讨论”。那么好，我们用数字来讲话，看看你以上的
原话是多么地不靠谱：
盐湖城冬奥会的规模：几千名来自77个国家的运动员，十几万工作人员和志愿者，四亿
美元的运作资金.（ pathetically small Winter Olympics？）
盐湖城 - 总人口一百二十万。（ in the middle of nowhere？）
所以呢，人还是谦虚一些，不要随便口吐狂言的好。
【在 S******4 的大作中提到】
: Contrary to your twisted logic, experience in private industry and some
: pathetically small Winter Olympics in the middle of nowhere has nothing to
: do with being a great president.
: Did Franklin Delano Roosevelt work in private industry
: Did Abraham Lincoln?
: You with your limited knowledge in US history bought into the Romney sales
: pitch that a great CEO == a great President, which can't be further from
: truth.
|
d*********2
发帖数: 48111 | 73 又来犯幼稚病了， 有卖Benz SLR的， 就还有卖奇瑞的
什么叫marketing.
现在的现状是有钱人想开保时捷就开多快， 开东方不败以下的都限速30mph, 因为no
car left behind.
pre-K之前的daycare就是纯私利driven的， 最贵的未必就是最好的， 天价幼儿园一
年几万几十万， 我找个1200的一样能满足我的需求， 也能达到我的教育预期。
your
make
the
【在 S******4 的大作中提到】
: Let's be real, you are the President of a good school.
: Do you
: (1) Accept rich kids, charge them a lot, build a strong alumni with their
: rich parents. With all the money, you can hire great teachers and make your
: schools better.
: (2) Accept poor kids and pay them. Hope their own academic merits will make
: your school better, even if you might not have money to hire good teachers
: and build good schools.
: For now, (1) has been happening throughout this country, and throughout the
: whole human history.
|
B******e
发帖数: 16928 | 74 I just don't see how market can do anything worse than this. Calpers is one
of the forces driving California toward bankruptcy. Education is important.
Whether it should be done using public money is not obvious. Every dollar of
public money is taken from private enterprises and private sector is more
efficient than public.
【在 h********0 的大作中提到】
: Don't pretend you are from an elite family, you are a world apart
: from it. Charter schools do better than public, and harvard and MIT
: do better than state universities, do you suggest we should not
: invest in state universities? common, don't behave like a child. Small
: government is good, but it does not mean public education is
: not important.
|
S******4
发帖数: 2865 | 75 US economy: $15,000,000,000,000
Salt lake budget: $4,000,000,000
US popualtion: 308,000,000
Salt lake city: 1,200,000
Yes, I will say it again:
Running winter Olympics in the middle of nowhere is "pathetically small" and
"pathetically easy" comparing to being the President of United States.
【在 m******O 的大作中提到】
: "some pathetically small Winter Olympics in the middle of nowhere"
: 你在另一个帖子里说你要“严肃的讨论”。那么好，我们用数字来讲话，看看你以上的
: 原话是多么地不靠谱：
: 盐湖城冬奥会的规模：几千名来自77个国家的运动员，十几万工作人员和志愿者，四亿
: 美元的运作资金.（ pathetically small Winter Olympics？）
: 盐湖城 - 总人口一百二十万。（ in the middle of nowhere？）
: 所以呢，人还是谦虚一些，不要随便口吐狂言的好。
|
S******4
发帖数: 2865 | 76 +1
本质上就是给富人叫嚣的一条狗。
【在 h********0 的大作中提到】
: Don't pretend you are from an elite family, you are a world apart
: from it. Charter schools do better than public, and harvard and MIT
: do better than state universities, do you suggest we should not
: invest in state universities? common, don't behave like a child. Small
: government is good, but it does not mean public education is
: not important.
|
d*********2
发帖数: 48111 | 77 那种小白的贴真是懒的回， 08ma当总统前最多只管过几百人的一个社区， 都不能算
管， organizer, so what?
现在奥运会， 麻州，multi-B的公司，都不能证明管理能力和leadership了，
看来只有社区volunteer才能展现leadership。
【在 m******O 的大作中提到】
: "some pathetically small Winter Olympics in the middle of nowhere"
: 你在另一个帖子里说你要“严肃的讨论”。那么好，我们用数字来讲话，看看你以上的
: 原话是多么地不靠谱：
: 盐湖城冬奥会的规模：几千名来自77个国家的运动员，十几万工作人员和志愿者，四亿
: 美元的运作资金.（ pathetically small Winter Olympics？）
: 盐湖城 - 总人口一百二十万。（ in the middle of nowhere？）
: 所以呢，人还是谦虚一些，不要随便口吐狂言的好。
|
b********e
发帖数: 162 | 78 The right question is
"why does a poor kid have to go to Harvard to have a decent life?"
【在 B******e 的大作中提到】
: Why does Harvard accept poor kids?
:
: your
: make
: the
|
g***y
发帖数: 1268 | 79 我就建议所有public school马上就地私有化。然后政府把所有给public school的拨款
变成voucher（中国叫助学卷），发给每个学生的家长。由学生和家长自由选择学校。
我保证所有public school 的问题全部解决。
Romneys,
【在 S******4 的大作中提到】
: That's completely, absolutely, horrendously, 100% BULLSHIT.
: By your disgusting and stupid logic, demand for good schools will only
: appear in rich districts. Good teachers should only teach the young Romneys,
: but
: not the young Obamas.
: This is why we have public education in every country in the world, US,
: China, Europe and even North Korea...
: Government should provide basic education to everyone regardless of race,
: income and gender.
: If what you said becomes true (believe it won't), then it would really be
|
S******4
发帖数: 2865 | 80 I don't see how.
Rich people will end up with good, more expensive schools, poor people will
end up with bad, cheaper schools. You agree?
我觉得国内的教育系统还不错，小学，初中政府保证质量；高中，大学就是应该按成绩
来考。
China's economy miracle is actually a miracle of education.
【在 g***y 的大作中提到】
: 我就建议所有public school马上就地私有化。然后政府把所有给public school的拨款
: 变成voucher（中国叫助学卷），发给每个学生的家长。由学生和家长自由选择学校。
: 我保证所有public school 的问题全部解决。
:
: Romneys,
|
|
|
g***y
发帖数: 1268 | 81 假如每个学生每个月有$1000 voucher，他就可以获得平均水平的教育。富人如果决定
不够，就自己加钱去更好的学校。
所有的学校在市场上相互竞争，水平就越来越高。
Voucher制度解决了左派需要的基本教育，和右派需要的自由竞争。
will
【在 S******4 的大作中提到】
: I don't see how.
: Rich people will end up with good, more expensive schools, poor people will
: end up with bad, cheaper schools. You agree?
: 我觉得国内的教育系统还不错，小学，初中政府保证质量；高中，大学就是应该按成绩
: 来考。
: China's economy miracle is actually a miracle of education.
|
d*********2
发帖数: 48111 | 82 大学和中学还有很多其他的考虑， 教育资源集中化等问题。
小学这样搞完全没有问题。 实际上很多华人子女小学也就是送个还不错的便宜私立应
付过去， 靠补习班抓学业。 度过工作不稳定和暂时没买房的阶段。
【在 g***y 的大作中提到】
: 我就建议所有public school马上就地私有化。然后政府把所有给public school的拨款
: 变成voucher（中国叫助学卷），发给每个学生的家长。由学生和家长自由选择学校。
: 我保证所有public school 的问题全部解决。
:
: Romneys,
|
B******e
发帖数: 16928 | 83 There is no economic miracle about China. China's so-called miracle is all
caused by allowing foreign capital to invest. Because China has so many
labor but no capital and no technology know-how, once foreign capital and
technology comes in with abundant cheap labor, how can an economy not grow
so fast? Meanwhile, all the reforms that the Chinese government did by
itself is a total failure, education reform, medicare reform, all completely
failure.
Your conclusion is not correct. Even Harvard has poor students and not all
rich kids are able to get into Harvard. If you let market handle this, each
school will choose its own strategy with a combination of wealth and talent.
will
【在 S******4 的大作中提到】
: I don't see how.
: Rich people will end up with good, more expensive schools, poor people will
: end up with bad, cheaper schools. You agree?
: 我觉得国内的教育系统还不错，小学，初中政府保证质量；高中，大学就是应该按成绩
: 来考。
: China's economy miracle is actually a miracle of education.
|
d*********2
发帖数: 48111 | 84 现在re-urbanize, 很多年轻小白couple也是这样干的
【在 d*********2 的大作中提到】
: 大学和中学还有很多其他的考虑， 教育资源集中化等问题。
: 小学这样搞完全没有问题。 实际上很多华人子女小学也就是送个还不错的便宜私立应
: 付过去， 靠补习班抓学业。 度过工作不稳定和暂时没买房的阶段。
|
g***y
发帖数: 1268 | 85 我是说中小学了。大学是another story。
现在制度的最大问题是对于去private school的家长不fair，他不愿意把孩子放在这个
doom的system里面，但是他还得纳税来支持这个doom的system.
另外可以解决学区的问题，省得大家拼命花钱买好学区的房子。
【在 d*********2 的大作中提到】
: 大学和中学还有很多其他的考虑， 教育资源集中化等问题。
: 小学这样搞完全没有问题。 实际上很多华人子女小学也就是送个还不错的便宜私立应
: 付过去， 靠补习班抓学业。 度过工作不稳定和暂时没买房的阶段。
|
S******4
发帖数: 2865 | 86 Why do you think companies manufacture in China not India? India is even
cheaper with no Communist government.
http://www.ted.com/talks/yasheng_huang.html
completely
【在 B******e 的大作中提到】
: There is no economic miracle about China. China's so-called miracle is all
: caused by allowing foreign capital to invest. Because China has so many
: labor but no capital and no technology know-how, once foreign capital and
: technology comes in with abundant cheap labor, how can an economy not grow
: so fast? Meanwhile, all the reforms that the Chinese government did by
: itself is a total failure, education reform, medicare reform, all completely
: failure.
: Your conclusion is not correct. Even Harvard has poor students and not all
: rich kids are able to get into Harvard. If you let market handle this, each
: school will choose its own strategy with a combination of wealth and talent.
|
B******e
发帖数: 16928 | 87 Because communist government is able to cater to foreigner's needs more
efficiently. You see how many people in India object to Walmart's expansion
there? But all reforms conducted by Chinese itself is totally failure.
【在 S******4 的大作中提到】
: Why do you think companies manufacture in China not India? India is even
: cheaper with no Communist government.
: http://www.ted.com/talks/yasheng_huang.html
:
: completely
|
d*********2
发帖数: 48111 | 88 中学， 在美国来说， 最重要的是治安问题， 私立要搞其实成本挺大的
公立的实际上和警察局， 少管所就是连锁店
【在 g***y 的大作中提到】
: 我是说中小学了。大学是another story。
: 现在制度的最大问题是对于去private school的家长不fair，他不愿意把孩子放在这个
: doom的system里面，但是他还得纳税来支持这个doom的system.
: 另外可以解决学区的问题，省得大家拼命花钱买好学区的房子。
|
g***y
发帖数: 1268 | 89 你是不知道现在中国的中小学是怎么回事了。
好学区的公立小学，学区房的价格惊人。你中午得去接孩子，下午3点得去接孩子。
所以很多人都去把孩子送到私立学校，一年1－2万的学费。教学质量好，家长的负担轻。
will
【在 S******4 的大作中提到】
: I don't see how.
: Rich people will end up with good, more expensive schools, poor people will
: end up with bad, cheaper schools. You agree?
: 我觉得国内的教育系统还不错，小学，初中政府保证质量；高中，大学就是应该按成绩
: 来考。
: China's economy miracle is actually a miracle of education.
|
S******4
发帖数: 2865 | 90 I love moderates! =)
How to guarantee this "假如每个学生每个月有$1000 voucher，他就可以获得平均水
平的教育" though?
Also geography will be a challenge, what if the good school is on the other
side of the city that the poor kids cannot commute too?
【在 g***y 的大作中提到】
: 假如每个学生每个月有$1000 voucher，他就可以获得平均水平的教育。富人如果决定
: 不够，就自己加钱去更好的学校。
: 所有的学校在市场上相互竞争，水平就越来越高。
: Voucher制度解决了左派需要的基本教育，和右派需要的自由竞争。
:
: will
|
|
|
g***y
发帖数: 1268 | 91 所以就得挤到好学区，用钱来进行种族隔离。
【在 d*********2 的大作中提到】
: 中学， 在美国来说， 最重要的是治安问题， 私立要搞其实成本挺大的
: 公立的实际上和警察局， 少管所就是连锁店
|
S******4
发帖数: 2865 | 92 Watch the video.
expansion
【在 B******e 的大作中提到】
: Because communist government is able to cater to foreigner's needs more
: efficiently. You see how many people in India object to Walmart's expansion
: there? But all reforms conducted by Chinese itself is totally failure.
|
B******e
发帖数: 16928 | 93 He is basically repeating my point. And it has nothing to do with the fact
that the reform by Chinese government itself without interference from
foreign capital is a complete failure.
【在 S******4 的大作中提到】
: Watch the video.
:
: expansion
|
S******4
发帖数: 2865 | 94 The title of the video is: Does democracy stifle economic growth?
His answer is NO.
I can't see why he is making your point... at all.
Quote:
- The advantage China had over India is: human capital, nothing else.
- China' greatest advantage: education
- In 1991, adult literacy rate: China 77%, Inida 48%. In women, China 68%,
India 33%.
【在 B******e 的大作中提到】
: He is basically repeating my point. And it has nothing to do with the fact
: that the reform by Chinese government itself without interference from
: foreign capital is a complete failure.
|
d*********2
发帖数: 48111 | 95 我在美国见到的第一个高中就差点以为是警察局或者监狱。 当时门口站了８个条子
【在 g***y 的大作中提到】
: 所以就得挤到好学区，用钱来进行种族隔离。
|
g***y
发帖数: 1268 | 96 Voucher在美国就是极右的立场了。因为Voucher完全摧毁了Union的势力。
Voucher可以是cost neutral。假如现在政府给学校拨这么多钱，得到这种质量的教育
。你就把同样这么多钱，按人头分给每个学生，然后教育的质量就至少是现有的水平。
当然竞争之后，水平就越来越好。
另外竞争会解决geographic distribution的问题。所以不可能好学校集中在某个特定
地方。
other
【在 S******4 的大作中提到】
: I love moderates! =)
: How to guarantee this "假如每个学生每个月有$1000 voucher，他就可以获得平均水
: 平的教育" though?
: Also geography will be a challenge, what if the good school is on the other
: side of the city that the poor kids cannot commute too?
|
B******e
发帖数: 16928 | 97 I told you it is because India's hostility to foreign capital, not democracy
either. And that still has nothing to do with China's own reform being a
complete failure.
【在 S******4 的大作中提到】
: The title of the video is: Does democracy stifle economic growth?
: His answer is NO.
: I can't see why he is making your point... at all.
: Quote:
: - The advantage China had over India is: human capital, nothing else.
: - China' greatest advantage: education
: - In 1991, adult literacy rate: China 77%, Inida 48%. In women, China 68%,
: India 33%.
|
d*********2
发帖数: 48111 | 98 中国现在很多地方和美国挺像的。
我父母的房子， 比北边几条街外的同类型（更接近市中心）贵了３０多万， 就是因
为在全市最好的高中旁边。 如果出租， 光高考补习班的家长陪读就可以租2500+/
month.
不过听说北京黄庄那里更夸张。
轻。
【在 g***y 的大作中提到】
: 你是不知道现在中国的中小学是怎么回事了。
: 好学区的公立小学，学区房的价格惊人。你中午得去接孩子，下午3点得去接孩子。
: 所以很多人都去把孩子送到私立学校，一年1－2万的学费。教学质量好，家长的负担轻。
:
: will
|
d*********2
发帖数: 48111 | 99 可以接受food stamp， 为啥不可以接受voucher?
【在 g***y 的大作中提到】
: Voucher在美国就是极右的立场了。因为Voucher完全摧毁了Union的势力。
: Voucher可以是cost neutral。假如现在政府给学校拨这么多钱，得到这种质量的教育
: 。你就把同样这么多钱，按人头分给每个学生，然后教育的质量就至少是现有的水平。
: 当然竞争之后，水平就越来越好。
: 另外竞争会解决geographic distribution的问题。所以不可能好学校集中在某个特定
: 地方。
:
: other
|
S******4
发帖数: 2865 | 100 I actually don't care about left or right... union or rich people. =) Good
policy is good policy, and the party that executes good policy will be
rewarded (in the long run).
I still think voucher program will be biased towards the rich, hence not a
good policy in the long run, because in a "perfect" market, the ones with
money alwasy dictates.
What will likely happen is that your assumption of "教育的质量就至少是现有的
水平" might not be valid. Or... even if the market-average quality stays the
same, the schools serving poor cities and areas (don't forget rural areas)
will get worse and schools in rich areas will get better and better.
If you look at the existing private universities, I think it certainly looks
like this way - private schools are either awesome or garbabge (野鸡大学),
while the public schools are in the middle and remain relatively cheap.
【在 g***y 的大作中提到】
: Voucher在美国就是极右的立场了。因为Voucher完全摧毁了Union的势力。
: Voucher可以是cost neutral。假如现在政府给学校拨这么多钱，得到这种质量的教育
: 。你就把同样这么多钱，按人头分给每个学生，然后教育的质量就至少是现有的水平。
: 当然竞争之后，水平就越来越好。
: 另外竞争会解决geographic distribution的问题。所以不可能好学校集中在某个特定
: 地方。
:
: other
|
|
|
d*********2
发帖数: 48111 | 101 主要是美国有钱人和已经买了学区房的也不待见这个idea.
所以说， 美国的阶级壁垒还是很森严的。
无产们其实也就是想从中产身上割几块肉，他们也无意改变阶级构成， 无产比中产还
爽， 拿的少点， 工作压力和强度都不是一个档次的， 人１８岁以后就开始happy
了， 中产３８可能刚出来工作。
只有中产到无产的这个变动，很多是非自愿的
【在 g***y 的大作中提到】
: Voucher在美国就是极右的立场了。因为Voucher完全摧毁了Union的势力。
: Voucher可以是cost neutral。假如现在政府给学校拨这么多钱，得到这种质量的教育
: 。你就把同样这么多钱，按人头分给每个学生，然后教育的质量就至少是现有的水平。
: 当然竞争之后，水平就越来越好。
: 另外竞争会解决geographic distribution的问题。所以不可能好学校集中在某个特定
: 地方。
:
: other
|
B******e
发帖数: 16928 | 102 That is because the market is not free. Once it is completely free market,
you will see middle level private schools. Now because of public subsidy it
is simply not cost effective to do a private school with intermediate
quality.
the
)
【在 S******4 的大作中提到】
: I actually don't care about left or right... union or rich people. =) Good
: policy is good policy, and the party that executes good policy will be
: rewarded (in the long run).
: I still think voucher program will be biased towards the rich, hence not a
: good policy in the long run, because in a "perfect" market, the ones with
: money alwasy dictates.
: What will likely happen is that your assumption of "教育的质量就至少是现有的
: 水平" might not be valid. Or... even if the market-average quality stays the
: same, the schools serving poor cities and areas (don't forget rural areas)
: will get worse and schools in rich areas will get better and better.
|
S******4
发帖数: 2865 | 103 You guys still haven't address the basic assumption for education service, a
fundemental requirement that makes it impossible to work in free market.
Free market works for economic goods - if you have money, you buy Ferrari,
if you don't, you buy Toyota, and you won't die if you can't buy a car.
Education is not an economic good, it's a basic human and civil right, that
everyone should get good primary to high school education. (If you don't
agree with this, there is nothing for us to agree on.)
How to maintain the basic level of education? I totally agree some of the
current Union-controlled public schools are totally crap and inefficient.
But moving to 100% voucher system will cause the bottom to fall out, that
some people will be so poor and so geographically isolated (esp rural areas)
that their only choice will be some crap schools.
Again, devil is in the details...
At least now we know how difficult this kind of issue is (and it's much
simpler than federal budget). Maybe that's what we can agree to disagree,
instead of simply calling Obama "Socialist" or Romney a rich devil.
it
【在 B******e 的大作中提到】
: That is because the market is not free. Once it is completely free market,
: you will see middle level private schools. Now because of public subsidy it
: is simply not cost effective to do a private school with intermediate
: quality.
:
: the
: )
|
g***y
发帖数: 1268 | 104 首先，market average 以下的学校去的人越来越少，然后就out of business, 然后更
capable的学校进来take over。这样学校的质量只会越来越好。
现在public school的水平本来就是local决定的。New york和Alabama本来就不可能一
样，NYC和upper state也不可能一样。inner city, suburb和rural也都不一样。没有
人可以使它门都一样，也不应该一样。
现在能做到的只是在一个小范围内进行竞争，提高水平。
the
)
【在 S******4 的大作中提到】
: I actually don't care about left or right... union or rich people. =) Good
: policy is good policy, and the party that executes good policy will be
: rewarded (in the long run).
: I still think voucher program will be biased towards the rich, hence not a
: good policy in the long run, because in a "perfect" market, the ones with
: money alwasy dictates.
: What will likely happen is that your assumption of "教育的质量就至少是现有的
: 水平" might not be valid. Or... even if the market-average quality stays the
: same, the schools serving poor cities and areas (don't forget rural areas)
: will get worse and schools in rich areas will get better and better.
|
